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Replacing the COTM system with the RAW system?


Sandra
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RAW system  

36 members have voted

  1. 1. Would you want to see the RAW system implemented instead of the current COTM system (see topic content for more information)?

    • Yes
      26
    • No
      9
    • Maybe [explain in the comments]
      1
  2. 2. When should a potential RAW list reset?

    • After one month
      11
    • After two months
      2
    • After three months
      19
  3. 3. What kind of reward system would you like for a potential RAW system per reset (i.e. what would make your clan participate)?

    • [1 month option A]: #1 gets 70m + a signature + an advertisement banner on the forums for 30 days + special discord rank for members + custom icon/badge for members on the forums
      11
    • [1 month option B]: #1 gets 35m (and everything else mentioned in choise 1); #2 gets 20m; #3 gets 15m
      0
    • [2 months option A]: #1 gets 150m + a signature + an advertisement banner on the forums for 60 days + special discord rank for members + custom icon/badge for members on the forums
      1
    • [2 months option B]: #1 gets 75m (and everything else mentioned in choise 3); #2 gets 45m: #3 gets 30m
      1
    • [3 months option A]: #1 gets 200m + a signature + an advertisement banner on the forums for 90 days + special discord rank for members + custom icon/badge for members on the forums;
      8
    • [3 months option B]: #1 gets 100m (and everything else mentioned in choise 5); #2 gets 60m; #3 gets 40m
      6
    • Other reward [write it down in the comments based on the amounts of months you selected]
      3


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15 hours ago, Godfather said:

tried suggesting it to slush, he seemed uninterested. basically gotta accept that the shitty system will remain. this is what we used in 2017 (most competitive year since 2011) when we did the 1-5 def movement, i piggybacked it off of IVP's top clan topic (now deleted) - could perhaps tweak it but these days i honestly don't care about this community.

 

301fc0dd7f374bc3b3e763ab19379251.png.b37808135fbd2b58eb553a323ec6a63f.png

it still doesn't solve the issue of starvation... pointing a gun to head of clans asking to fight isn't going to work in 2020

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17 hours ago, Godfather said:

tried suggesting it to slush, he seemed uninterested. basically gotta accept that the shitty system will remain. this is what we used in 2017 (most competitive year since 2011) when we did the 1-5 def movement, i piggybacked it off of IVP's top clan topic (now deleted) - could perhaps tweak it but these days i honestly don't care about this community.

 

301fc0dd7f374bc3b3e763ab19379251.png.b37808135fbd2b58eb553a323ec6a63f.png

Well done for putting this together. I do however feel we have to keep things simple for the majority and encourage clans to fight the clan above them, instead of avoiding. Clans can avoid and have preps outside of the system, but they wouldn't be rewarded or get to claim they're the #1 CW clan in F2P or P2P.
 

16 hours ago, wars. said:

hmmm not sure about this.

Could you elaborate? 
 

15 hours ago, Zalmon said:

This has been tried multiple times, same as PCL. Doubt it will work this time

It actually hasn't as far as I know, it has been suggested multiple times though, but in the end it's up to Sharkbrew to implement it.
 

14 hours ago, BvG said:

I've been gunning for the RAW system for years. It was fun as hell for CWA fullouts with ML lock back in the day, but realistically that won't be achievable anymore and would just be a headache for staff.

This will probably be a headache for staff, too, but much less of one.

I'd like to see it tried.

This version would focus on matched clanwars preps, not fullouts. The WCOTM system could be kept, because promoting and rewarding midweek activity is good.
 

13 hours ago, ubermensch said:

RAW would be sick and a very nice change to the community.
 

Of course there would need to be a way for clans to not only fight whomever is above them in ranking.

The whole idea of the RAW system is to fight the clan 1 place above you, and to do so until you're #1. This makes the rankings very clear for F2P and P2P with regard to CW. It's the fairest method to decide who's #1. You have to keep performing to keep the #1 spot. If the #3 clan declares on #2, and #2 refuses to fight after X-amount of days, #3 will gain the #2 spot, after which they can declare on #1. But you have to work hard to earn the #1 spot, this creates a sense of accomplishment and competitiveness. If everybody could just declare on the #1 clan, there would be no way to decide the rankings (which is the whole idea of the system).
 

12 hours ago, Doom kJ said:

Woah Sandra is around, that is a blast from the past!!!

 

Should stop by Zenith community and say hi to Hormone/Callum(Lol Spooned)/Eat Dark Bow/Rob(Blurred Pker)

Hello! Say hi to them for me! I'm not sure I could contact them via discord.
 

8 hours ago, Vanuckle said:

Could using both work?

No, since some clans would stick with the COTM system to avoid fighting certain clans. Afterwards you'd have people flame each other about who's the #1 clan during X-period. I believe the RAW system is the fairest method to rank all clans. The WCOTM system could be kept, since this RAW version would focus on CW (both F2P and P2P).
 

6 hours ago, Fear The Beard said:

RAW died a long time ago 

It did, but that was because the community forums back then were replaced (I forgot all the names of the community websites, you had pure-warfare and another one before that), and the RAW system wasn't reused by the admins of the new community forums. It would be up to Sharkbrew to implement it. So if enough people and ranks want it...
 

2 hours ago, Billy Costigan said:

Wouldn't work in 2k20.


Too many newfag avoider clans.

 

/thread

The whole point of this system is to reward clans for participating. If you don't participate, you won't get rewards and you won't be able to claim you're the #1 CW clan in F2P and/or P2P. Avoiding won't be rewarded, whereas you can still win COTM by avoiding. Avoiding shouldn't be rewarded in a competitive scene.
 

58 minutes ago, catchat said:

assuming pure clans play any part of this game competitively is a joke in itself. 

They sure do during the weekend, during mini's, and during preps that now and then occur. It's just that clans that avoid can still win COTM, which is wrong in my opinion. Even if you dislike clan X.

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1 hour ago, Asap said:

What you don’t seem to realise is that clans that don’t want to prep eachother still wont prep eachother just like right now. Using a different way to count points/rankings doesn’t change anything. 

So you don't care about the reward or being able to claim #1 CW clan in F2P and/or P2P? What would make you care?

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25 minutes ago, Sandra said:

So you don't care about the reward or being able to claim #1 CW clan in F2P and/or P2P? What would make you care?

I think alot of people don’t care as much about runescape community awards as you seem to think. And actually my clan has claimed the #1 cotm award like 3 or 4 times in a row now.

But just to make it clear to you: making a different system is not going to force clans prep vs clans they don’t want to.

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25 minutes ago, Sandra said:

So you don't care about the reward or being able to claim #1 CW clan in F2P and/or P2P? What would make you care?

Again you miss the point, you’re saying this will encourage clans to fight each other when in reality you’re not in touch with the community enough to suggest that. 
Saying that monetary prizes, awards and bragging rights will make clans fight is incorrect - as recently as one month ago the longest standing pure clan (Fo) refused to fight the number one matched clan in F2P (Rage) in the Cotm decider when all three of these things were on the line.

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49 minutes ago, Sandra said:

So you don't care about the reward or being able to claim #1 CW clan in F2P and/or P2P? What would make you care?

Everyone is #1. They don't need some washed up loser telling them they are #1 on a made up list. Were sticking with COTM and I will get my siggy every month and there is nothing you can do about it. You are irrelevant and have no impact on this community go disappear again and pretend you don't play.

Thank you @puppyslushfor creating a magnificent system long live COTM!

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1 hour ago, Broxxx said:

Again you miss the point, you’re saying this will encourage clans to fight each other when in reality you’re not in touch with the community enough to suggest that. 
Saying that monetary prizes, awards and bragging rights will make clans fight is incorrect - as recently as one month ago the longest standing pure clan (Fo) refused to fight the number one matched clan in F2P (Rage) in the Cotm decider when all three of these things were on the line.

I know Foe declined, which was sad to see, but if people aren't willing to try and do their best to make the community better, then everybody might as well stop clanning if it's so horrible.

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8 hours ago, puppyslush said:

it still doesn't solve the issue of starvation... pointing a gun to head of clans asking to fight isn't going to work in 2020

 

its not meant to solve the issue of starvation, those who starve sit at the bottom of the ladder. reintroducing the raw list in '17 helped solve it partially and put fo down to #4 after sitting at "#1" for an entire year after starving TLP and farming wins off of Fi

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The community has changed too much for anything like this to work, the last time it worked as intended was 13 years ago. It worked very well at that point and was one of the features of the pure community, highlighted by Fatality challenging Eruption of Pures for #1 in summer 2007 and making record traffic and engagement on PC. I’ve got a list of all the pure clans on the RAW list then, and it was over 30 with semi regular wars for places. 

Bounty Hunter craters was the death knell of it, it made a brief resurgence when clan wars started figuring into the equation but as Sefket’s Pure Community closed down and with it the RAW list, it ceased to exist at all.

With Clan Wars it was the perfect place for it as crashing and or cheating had been a slight issue in the wilderness era so there were high hopes that it could be ressurected in the sterile and fair CW environment. Myself and Omni brought it back on the successor community Pure Warfare and that had some legs for a while, but even then the attitude of the pure community was changing and other than a few big wars it wasn’t used by the participants to its advantage. I remember a clan opening and joining it at #17 during this period and having bi-weekly important, meaningful RAW wars (fighting #16, then #15, etc) and it really propelled their clan. When fights have high stakes it creates good morale. Unfortunately the higher the clan climbed the higher tier clans were defensive of their position and fights came to a halt. It reached a boiling point when MM left the RAW list and FOE, and some other higher tier clans left. After that it was inauthentic. For it to work it needs maximum engagement by all clans in the community, and most importantly the TOP clans in the community. These days that would be an impossible task.
 

In the heyday of the RAW list clans were much more agreeable with each other and realised the potential of using the RAW list to expand their clans. As time went on clans became less stable and one loss could mean their clan would close; this has accelerated into the modern era where seemingly no clan will admit a loss. Why would a clan potentially risk losing and the closure of their clan? It suffered inactivity and quietly was shelved, and would probably see the same fate if implemented today.
 

In principal it’s a great idea but the realistic take on it is that it could never work. Since 2011 or whenever it was last tried with real focus the clans in the community have become much more introverted and it simply isn’t in the best interests of these clans to be a part of something like this. Top clans wouldn’t join it even to start with and render it unimportant. It’s a shame because at its height it was a great tool for the community. 
 

 

 

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15 hours ago, Broxxx said:

Again you miss the point, you’re saying this will encourage clans to fight each other when in reality you’re not in touch with the community enough to suggest that. 
Saying that monetary prizes, awards and bragging rights will make clans fight is incorrect - as recently as one month ago the longest standing pure clan (Fo) refused to fight the number one matched clan in F2P (Rage) in the Cotm decider when all three of these things were on the line.

that shit was fucking cancer to arrange and it still didn't result in a fight when members were literally begging for it

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