Ivp

Aha, think you read my post but missed the point entirely. Lets be honest, the skill cap in runescape is low. Its actually incredibly justin beibery for me to hear people say stuff on forums like this such as "LMAO U SUCK AT WARRING". This isn't figure skating or carpentry, and actual technique/skill in runescape is non existent and your an absolute loser if you believe the contrary. You pot up, you eat food, you press spec, you click to move. Thats fine. 10 year olds play this game. Rs Pservs probably have some people who enjoy warring and know all the tricks etc, but thats not what I was getting at. The main argument for clanning on Pservs is that people don't want to train their accounts, which is fine. However, like I said, by default this means that these Pserv clans simply couldn't compete on 07. How could Pserv clans compete on 07 when the members in said clans don't want to train an 07 account? They'd have low numbers, leading to internal problems, leading to eventual closure. If any of the clans mentioned in this topic as being the best private server clan moved to 07, that clan wouldn't make it past a few weeks, simply because the memberbase isn't willing to put the effort in to creating a decent 07 account. Its that simple, and has nothing to do with perceived 'skill' on Runescape.

You say 07 is a game thats going no where. As opposed to Private servers that are going somewhere, right? haha come on, you can't really use that as an argument. Especially considering the opposite is probably true, as Pservs die all the time and there always seems to be an ongoing mass exodus to another server or whatever. At least in that regard 07 is a stable version of the game that you know is going no where, which is a positive thing really. I'm not saying the people on these private servers are bad warrers at all, Runescape is made for children and warring in runescape is almost insultingly simple, so lets debunk the myth between "AWESOME WARRERS" and "BAD WARRERS". If you've got brain cells, your a good warrer on Runescape haha. It really isn't difficult. In the out and out comparison with 07 clans they will always be B league, rightly or wrongly, due to the fact a good clan is usually a collection of people enjoying a shared journey/experience. Clans become good from building a foundation and crafting a legacy, which simply doesn't occur in most of the private server clans. In this very topic someone said Which shows that in 3 hours fresh from lumbridge or whatever, your in the clan and ready to own. In 07, its a longer experience by training accounts, intro'ing on forums, joining clans, etc. Whilst the time it takes isn't too long, its long enough that joining a clan actually means something and has required effort; human nature insists that if effort is put in, you feel much more strongly about wanting to win and wanting your clan to succeed. The fact is NONE of these Private server clans could compete on 07scape. Not from skill level or anything like that, but simply because the members want the quick 3 hour route as opposed to the dedication route. You wouldn't want to train an account up and all the other stuff needed to make an 07 account and I'm sure alot of the pserv clanners are the same, so the people who do have the dedication/willpower to do so WIN BY DEFAULT. If any Pserv clan moved to 07 they'd lose their memberbase who didn't wanna train, have no members, and as such, not be able to compete. To conclude and to sum it up, I have no idea whos leading Massacre or any of the other private server clans but I think the proof is in the pudding in that Massacre were a substandard clan when they were open on "real" runescape, and only found success when moving to private servers. If a substandard clan could take the mantle of "#1 PSERV CLAN EVA", then what does that say about the competition as a whole in the pserv community? Again, I'm not insulting anybody who plays these Pservs or is in clans there, who am I to tell you guys what to do. I'm sure its great fun for you guys and I'm sure I'd enjoy it too. But suggesting these pserv clans can hold a candle to the better clans of 07 is ridiculous.

Whereas I have a PHd in pure clanning, I don't know a whole lot about pserver clanning but id like to think I know enough to make a judgement. They're all terrible for the most part (probability suggests there is a couple of exceptions) and always have been, until proven to me otherwise. It's pretty much the B leagues of pure clanning, and considering the quality in the A league, that's pretty bad. There is a reason they've chosen a private server to open their clan on, haha. Is the Massacre people are saying the same one that was open on 'real' RS years ago?

Don't know specifics, but alot of the newer people look at sites like this as a throwback to a more ridiculous age which is why they don't sign up/post around; why would they? Horrible trolls, unwelcoming to newcomers, etc. As such, people in this community rarely know who they are as they're pretty self contained in their own clans/communities. I've noticed a general trend towards less centralized clans actually and more secluded clans, more and more of the newer clans don't utilize IRC/forums the same as the older clans once did. Back in the day, if a clan had 60 people in their IRC PK channel chances are they were pulling something similar to that. These days TS is a more common method of communication and as such people don't have a whole lot to do with other clans. But the fact remains there are a tonne of brand new players joining SOME of these LPC's. Conquer is a good example of this with 30+ people on TS at times with alot of brand new people or people who arn't well known in the community at large. I had a conversation with BvG too last week and hes the same with Olympus/his other clans, recruits alot of members outside the pure community. And I know Sithlord and company have also built RD and DR from an overwhelming amount of first timers, and evidently had huge success doing so. Some new clans rely on only "namers" from the community, I guess arguments can be made for both approaches, but ultimately if the staff team is already experienced and a members RS character can wield a rune scimitar, thats all thats important in the grand scheme of things. Its interesting to see how clans have changed over the years, and this new generation of pure clans/clanners really emphasizes that.

Good luck : ) It was certainly an advantage for those two clans in particular having a memberbase attached to the leadership, but i've taken that into account and the sole reason for starting the tournament at 10 vs 10 and then moving up weekly (ie, week 2 15 vs 15) is so the clans that might have a smaller memberbase can recruit their own unique memberbase in easy increments and go about building their own core, so they don't neccessarily have to rely on older guys coming back or whatever. These are the first three with websites et cetera that I included in the topic for the sake of getting the topic out with at least a starting point in sight, I've not included clans such as Curse/Escape/Remedy and a bunch of others that are in the formation stages so hopefully by the end of the year there will be in excess of 6/7 solid low level pure clans, not to mention the "less solid" low level pure clans. Why don't you open a clan and show these "tomatos" what a real leader looks like, swg420?

Introduction Back in April, the first 'manufactured' scene of LPC clans arose in Zerg Unit/Supremacy/Trauma/Hate. The hypeball began rolling, and these clans were soon joined by clans such as Bloody Vikingz/Destruction/Leet Tactics/Zenith amongst others, to create a highly active and productive low level scene. Whilst its true many clans closed during the period between then and now, this was always to be expected; the stronger clans rose to the top of the pile and managed to succeed where others could not. The weaker or less focused clans were sacrificed to contribute to the growth of the stronger clans, something which has been repeating itself since the start of the pure community back in 2004. Current clans such as Sup/Zu/LT/BV, not to mention the recently closed DR, were all products of this LPC scene and have directly contributed to the growth of the pure community, doubling it in size. Now, 8 months on from the last wave of LPC's comes another, fresh batch of low level clans, all eager and hungry to prove their worth and become the next success stories from an LPC scene. Of course, last time wasn't without its fair share of problems, namely the amount of time it took these LPC's to "be ready" to join the rest of the pure community, progressively worse rule breaking in terms of combat caps and defense caps et cetera. That has been taken into consideration this time, and the entire approach to building a new generation of low level clans is completely different. The Approach The goal of manufacturing an LPC scene is to promote competition across the board and giving all clans the equal chance to grow. This allows the LPC's to help each other in giving them better competition and rivalries, and also gives all clans a better chance at eventually becoming an MPC. Back in April, Clan Wars didn't exist in the 07 version of the game, which meant that competition solely took place in the wilderness which is a knifes edge in terms of stability in regards to new clans trying to prosper. Now however, clan wars does exist, and it is the perfect place to enforce rules such as combat caps, defence caps, and fair fights which is the key to growth for new LPC clans. Therefore, in order to have the guaranteed fights that makes building a clan so important, and in order to give an incentive to stay within combat and defence caps, the LPC clans will be taking part in the inaugural "Sharkbrew Open", a clan wars tournament with a very specific format. Here is the vague outline; The rules will be firm; 69 combat cap, 1-5 defense cap. The tournament will be matched option fights, progressively growing larger and larger as the weeks progress. For example, Week 1 will be 10 vs 10. Week 2 will be 15 vs 15, Week 3 will be 20 vs 20. Week 4 will be 30 vs 30, eventually peaking at a sensible number. This incremental growth allows NEW clans with smaller memberbases the baby steps needed to recruit just 5 more people before the next week if need be, and over the course of a few months, will vastly improve the size of the memberlists in bite size, easy to achieve chunks for the entire scene. Not only this, but this will actually promote the invitation of people outside of the community INTO the community. Depending on the amount of clans entered, the tournament will run from between 1 to 2 months, giving plenty of time for new LPC clans to focus on short term goals with an ultimate long term achievement (winning the fights and hopefully, the tournament),whilst simultaneously building a core and a foundation for the future. Whilst we're still in the stage of discussing the terms and rules of the tournament, a league like system might be the initial stage with 3 points for a win and 1 point for a loss, promoting the idea of fighting the third round even if it is 2-0. The modern trend of leaving after the second loss is detrimental to the community as a whole, losing is a part of any competition and the quicker new clans learn that, the better there clan will be. The intensity of the tournament will be ramped up week by week, especially in the league portion as the clans fight for points in order to win, which will result in some unforgettable fights and the drama that everyone seems to enjoy so much. So, by the conclusion of the tournament, we should be looking at a potential 5+ LPC clans that are all pulling in excess of 30 people, as they have gradually recruited 5 people a week throughout the entire tournament if needed. They will have a solid foundation after having something to focus on (the tournament) and will have had plenty of practice in fighting others with fair and uninterrupted results. With the big pulls they'll be having, it isn't outside the realms of possibility that by the tournaments conclusion these low level clans can change their requirements/caps and begin to contend with the MPC's far more regularly than at the beggining of the tournament. Not to mention, fun all around. Now, let me be clear here. Of course Clan Wars isn't the only place where fighting will happen. Clan Wars is simply the perfect place for a new clan to find its bearings and have the fights they need to get a foothold in stability. The wilderness exists, and I think ALL LPC clans should be using it. However, the wilderness has proven itself to be a brutal and unforgiving place, which is why I am very concious of trying not to "hold the hand" of the LPC clans. Finding your own footing as a clan in the wilderness is important and I am of the opinion that clans shouldn't have their 'hand held', as its a detriment to them later down the line. The State of Things Currently Now, this isn't just mindless theorizing, the wheels are already in motion with several LPC's already open or very close to open, register on their forums/check out their IRC's and see whats going on with them. The ones that are in a state in which they have a website/irc/staff ready are as follows; http://clan-conquer.com/community/ http://anthrax-rs.com/community/ http://olympus-rs.com/elites/ http://clan-trauma.net/forums/ Other clans such as Escape, Remedy, and Curse etc also likely to join these clans. I wish all these clans good luck, they're already looking awesome. Lets hope that they do well and grow into respectable MPC clans in their own right somewhere down the line. What can YOU do? Alright, so this is where you guys come in. I'm inviting anybody and everybody who feels like its a good idea to get involved in this tournament to do so. The goal of this tournament is to build some viable LPC's that will go on to eventually fill out the community much the way Zu/Sup/BV/LT/etc have done, but the more competition for clans, the better, in any form. There will be clans that set out to be MPC's, but teams that exist solely for the tournament and will cease to exist AFTER it are also welcome and beneficial for the clans that DO want to be MPC's. If you have no intention of creating a clan but think its a great idea and sounds fun, don't let that deter you. Simply gather a bunch of friends, a bunch of clan members, or a bunch of random people (remember, 69 combat cap) think of a cool name, make an IRC, and enter the tournament. You don't have to be an official clan and can simply be a team in the tournament. If you have been thinking about creating a clan over the last few months (or ever, for that matter), now is the PERFECT time to do so. You've seen the success that CAN occur with things like this in the form of the clans from the last LPC batch that were successful. There literally is no better time than now; if your ever gonna do it, do it NOW. This is an excellent oppotunity that doesn't come along very often. Make the most of it. Conclusion I know its long but theres alot of information here and alot to be said. The last time an LPC scene was manafactured from nothing resulted in older clans such as EOP/CP/FI etc having double the amount of competition, some awesome fights, and the rejuvenation of the pure world. Hopefully when all is said and done, the current clans have ANOTHER 5+ clans to fight. Give it a chance. Thanks for reading

I'm guessing its averaged out, and the majority of those unique views that are not from registered guests are from when the site is ddos'ed. So when Sharkbrew gets ddos'ed its actually up'ing the value of the site by having more unique visitors/pageviews? Aha, thats funny.

MM late 2004

Awesome job RD, a great pull and looks like a great trip. Keep it up guys.

Sounds like it went well, great job on a successful event. Nice to see clans fighting clans down opts too. Its that sort of thing that spurs competition and pushes the pulls higher and higher each week as clans realise if they'd have pulled 5 more, they'd have had a more even fight. A step in the right direction for the pure community, hope everybody had fun

Nice one Zu, showing your a force in P2P as well as F2P

Great pull EOP, looks like you had some enjoyable practice fights

Goodluck everyone, Clan Wars is a great place to have fights without the influence of mains, crashing et cetera. Hope everyone has fun

Your really laughing your fucking ass off at that? Interesting sense of humour you oddball. Regardless, this team has never 'linked up' haha. I don't understand about the failure part, either. All of the people on that list has seen a lot of success in this community and every person on that list has done stuff which I believe would contribute towards a fun and rewarding clan for me to be a part of. No need to get all angsty. What would your dream team be, Kek? What clans you been in?

@ OP, is that REALLY your dream team? Even when considering all the other rank teams that CP have had over the years such as 07/08/09 with SPW/M4n etc? Aha shame on you newcomer Anyway... From my experience, in a simplified manner for the sake of the topic; Leaders - Me, Bob, Ben, HC - Plode, Marty, Scott, Desu PK Leaders - Jib, Prateek, Rage Cutter, Poison Karsh A bunch of officer/slave ranks Its a shame most of these guys have completely quit the game for good. As for a dream team that could still theoretically exist on the game (IE, playing currently or would come back) I've got a few ideas that utilizes people I know for a fact are still around, but they would be part of a rank structure that is completely different from anything that came before it. So, I won't spoil the surprise for when I create my next clan. There is still alot of decent ranks knocking around though, diamonds in the rough.

Great job Redemption, two impressive wins. Keep it up.

Doesn't really matter what clan you join; they're all the same anyway haha. Goodluck finding a clan

No, how can Bob be infected? He didn't get bit or anything. I think by the mid season finale the cannibal guys will be dealt with, it seems theres just a few of them knocking around and when Rick etc catch wind of whats going on, they're gonna annihilate their entire group. The second half of the season will probably deal with the guys who kidnapped Beth, heard some rumours about another certain individual getting captured by them too. Curious as to who they are though.

Don't see why not, they've got a solid memberbase and will have the early momentum to challenge the existing pure clans. Good luck to them

I don't think the problem with the pure community is community sites like this, in the past they've worked very well and this website continues to be an efficient place for pures of all clans to have some common ground. Despite the downward spiral that the pure community is in and has been in since Pre EOC, Sharkbrew and before that Clan Warfare have continued to grow in the "07 era". What these sort of websites are, however, are symbolic of the state of the community as a whole. Case in point; when the peak of the pure community was ongoing, community sites like this were exciting and entertaining to be a part of. I'll explain with pictures; Note, the #6 ranked Pure Clan that weekend "only" pulled 50 people and is considered a low pull (keep in mind that after CP in the "rankings" that week were clans such as Fi, IR et cetera who also pulled 50+) - in todays community that would be an astronomical pull for a week to week PK trip and enough to comfortably take the #1 spot. Due to the high octane and enjoyable nature of the community, this displayed itself on the community forums in a very visible way; 15k views and almost 500 replies, displaying just how interested people were in pure clanning in general. If we compare that to the interest in the PK trips of THIS era, where clans pull around 30 people for the most part... ...It shows that there is definitely a correlation between the state of the pure community and the state of the community forums associated with that community. Its the same for Zybez Clan Discussion, and any other clanning forums, you'll find exactly the same results if you went and looked at oldschool ROT/DI/VR/DF topics and compared them to topics of today. So now that we've established that community forums such as this are effectively mirrors of the pure community, what does THIS forum tell us about the community? There are many things this forum tell us about the pure community, but I'll leave that to you guys to make your own judgements as the post would extend far too long if I was to name them all. An example of one point. Clans members are not interested in representing their own pure clan and use fake names etc so that they can troll and make other clans look cauliflower, but also as a defense mechanism so they don't get flamed. Using the mirror symbolism, this is shown by the fact that these same clans will then sit in single for their weekly PK trip so they can't possibly lose, so they don't get flamed. Its the same thought process. Rather than working to win or beat other clans, the clans of today actively work the opposite way round so that they would rather they didn't lose, even if that comes at the cost of having no chance of winning. The pure community will never live up to the dizzying heights of the past, because its a new generation of children leading clans and being members of clans who simply don't understand how pure clanning works and look at the clans of the past and think "hay dats cool, ill lead a clan too" without any semblance of what is required to build a community and clan. We were all kids once, even leading clans, but for the most part the clans of the past understood how to make and maintain a decent pure clan, taking notes from the clans that came before them. As the years have gone on, the pure clanning ideology has become diluted year by year (Starting with MM/FOE, moving onto clans like EOP, Fi, moving onto clans like E and DP, moving onto clans like Zenith etc, moving onto now with clans like BV and CV - the clans have progressively got less successful when using the same "MM Formula"). Back to the topic at hand, I believe clan sites like this do have a place, yet they evolve to mirror the pure community. And in a community like this, the banter and intelligence levelsis always bound to be terrible. There will always be a spot for forums like this as its the nature of competition to want to see how everyone else is doing. If it's that bad I guess people can just simply stop using the forum; its not as if its necessary to do so. Longer than I'd have thought, but hopefully I made my point; sites like this are mirrors of the pure community.

Good luck to them, their site looks good. Hopefully they manage to provide the existing clans with fights and grow in their own right.

Was recruited to MM in 2004 by Ivi Fear Ivi, Shut It F00l, X0x h3ll x0x, Volcanic Fox, and a bunch of other people I occasionally PK'ed with. In 2005 I was recruited to Acid by ACIDY and Bonesaw, then to Final Ownage by Holy Jitte and Bonesaw. Had a stint in a clan called Drained and Pure Fear and was recruited by 0mfg0rz and V Fall3n V to those clans. Was recruited to Epidemic in 07 by Nikos, and then CP by Martin/SPW in 08. Since then, I was founder of Epidemic V2 and NME so I guess I recruited myself to those clans haha.

Interesting, I like that the averages are pretty accurate now due to stuff like 20 def showing up on the highscores, as opposed to pre-eoc when you needed like 35 def or something for highscores. Most of its expected, would be good if CP/FOE/LT sorted their ML's out and were added