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Rage battled against BP in some 23v23 P2P Minis
Won first set 2-0 and second set 2-1 - Thanks for the tussle BP we appreciate the action
Mite be time to start looking at using a 0.75% clip speed lil bee bros, these vids getting kind of short
Also your topic looked like it got more action than your trip so maybe look into making some shit up just to keep people interested
Today TheBeeHive massed up a solid 40 PrimeTimeKillerBees
and peaked at 45 for some Sunday smoke.
We defended inside barbarian village to fight against AAO.
After a few minutes of defending AAO came in hot from the south and west like a pack of wild Lion Kings.
We held our ground and barraged the west and south entrance, eventually taking control of the fight.
Shortly after, both Supremacy and Apex crashed the fight to see what's going on.
We opted to tele out and back in multiple times and had a back and forth scrap with AAO.
We finally left after something else was beginning and Apex crashed after a while.
We opted to defend against AAO again northeast, outside of falador.
We rushed from the east and went back forth with them before taking control again.
Supremacy decided to log in west of AAO and crash the fight so we backed out.
We setup another big fight at Al kharid against AAO.
We rushed from the west side and did well pushing with specs until Apex crashed behind AAO
We went south and opted to tele out being down opts afterward and regrouped at duel arena.
We rushed Apex from behind and caught them in a juicy clumperino before backing out.
Overall, trip was solid.
Decent amount of action considering a short Sunday
Thanks to all the PrimeTimeKillerBeez
Cya next sunday bros
What is your IRL name or nickname?
Liam
What are your web/gaming interests?
OSRS, Crypto trading
Do you have any IRL hobbies?
Not really
RUNESCAPE/CLANNING
Are you a clanner? If so, which clan? If not, are you interested in clanning?
Misfits - yes
Do you have a RuneScape account? If so, show us.
maxed, 60 att 52 prayer. Maxed gear, kodai, tbow(obv for infernal).
What are your goals with your account or clanning career?
Get involved in the community a bit more as I've never done clanning ever. So everything is new.
Member of Misfits having a great time learning a lot on new shit and differences about clanning compared to the normal game.
Have had some fun already doing preps wildy trips and F2P.
I have passed it along for you to a discord that Mod Ayiza idles in for community suggestions.
Personally, I feel Jagex should play a duopoly strategy where certain updates that should be polled, be polled while retaining sole deciding autonomy on niche updates
Problem
What is the problem?
The current update polling system is bias and broken.
disclaimer: This is not solely my idea. I know many players in the PvP community are aware of this (and are frustrated) and have potentially raised the issue in other forums.
As it stands in order for a concept to make it into the game—it first has to pass a poll.
The requirements for passing a poll is to reach a 75% majority vote of acceptance.
A person can vote on a poll ONCE on EVERY ACCOUNT they own as long as it has MEMBERSHIP.
This basic form of democracy comes with many flaws—two of which seem to be working simultaneously to give us our current flawed/unbalanced polling system.
summarized below as:
"Lack of education"
"Voters may not be educated enough to exercise their democratic rights prudently"
There seems to be two examples of this happening:
Firstly—Very few of the players, if any at all, are game designers. This role exists within the industry for a reason, designers/developers have experience in what makes a game fair/balanced/not too easy/not too hard, how the addition of certain items/effects can change a games meta for the better or worse.
I don't have anything to back up the following claim but I would put money on the 'fact' that less than 10% of the voter base actually consider the wider effects that an item or an update could have on the metagame. Most players vote solely on the 'cool factor' of an update ie. How much ridiculous damage can I hit, or what ridiculous amount of xp/money can I get.
This results in power creep and the degradation of games difficulty—these two effects impact the game negatively in that it discourages diversity of play style and equipment (see 126 edge bridding aka. "ags/maul/tabbing") and the devaluation of achievements (see Runescape 3 aka "get 99 rcing by afking for 2 weeks"). The game becomes repetitive, boring and unfulfilling.
Secondly—We have players voting on content which they are not engaged with/do not understand/in no way affects them (This leads quite nicely into the next polling flaw of "Mob rule"). If a PvMer is asked (for want of a better example) if teleblock should extend to f2p they're obviously going to vote no. Their whole goal in this game is to NOT die.
This doesn't mean that extending teleblock to f2p is a BAD idea. It just means the majority of voters are acting on their own impulses rather than considering what makes for a balanced game. There is currently no way to output enough damage in (singles) wilderness to PK someone skilling before they're able to teleport—this is not balanced. The wilderness is supposed to be high risk, high reward and particularly in f2p right now it's low risk.
Another example (don't quote me because I may be wrong) but it sounds like the off hand ranged "Bolas/net" isn't going to pass vote. These were in no way overpowered considering the operate effect would use spec bar... But because the majority of players are voting impulsively due to their aversion to dying, they vote no. These would have been a great addition to gear/build and strategy diversity without breaking the PKing meta (and tbh probably would mostly have been used by Nrangers in clw in conjuntion with acb/elder maul)
Yet here we have uneducated (or at the very least uninvolved) PvMers seeing the addition of a PvP specific item and instantly voting no because "I don't want more options for players to kill me in the wilderness" (even though the majority probably ventures into the wilderness < twice a week)
"Mob rule/Oppression by the majority"
I'm not sure what the actual statistic is but the PvP community is clearly outnumbered by the PvM community. Players who are given the right to vote about content they don't care about tend to push false opinions to entertain themselves (see every meme about voting, pking and skillers on r/2007scape)
Players are drawn into the idea that it's an 'us Vs them' situation and that everything must be done to oppress the otherside—including voting maliciously and or/creating polling propaganda topics to sway others to 'side' with them and vote against the 'opposition'
Rivalries between different groups of players can be entertaining and fun but it becomes detrimental when one side has the majority of the votes and is essentially determining the outcome of future content without considering the wider effects these updates could have.
How does it affect clanning?
We as a community of clans are deprived of potential, positive updates to osrs PvP, due to thoughtless voting and the ongoing 'rivalry/hatred/dislike' between players who engage primarily in PvM and those who engage primarily in PvP.
Additional effects and notes
Note: I understand that polling was introduced post EOC, due to the backlash JaGex received after making game-breaking decisions behind closed doors. I'm not saying that a polling system is a bad idea. It was a good idea. It was a big step in the right direction... however after 5 years of OSRS (or however long it's been) the game (and the polling system) is beginning to mature. We are seeing trends in the way in which updates are introduced into the game... some of which have a negative impact on the meta-game and should be addressed.
Note: It is obviously an impossible task for the osrs team to please every single one of their players with every update—however I believe someone somewhere must have (at least an idea for) a better system than the one we are currently subjected to.
Solution
Identifying the problem is the easy part and I'm not necessarily attempting to propose one single solution... I'd rather try to encourage brainstorming ways in which the problem could at the very least be lessened (maybe this isn't the correct board/forum for this conversation...idk)
My own thoughts on the matter would be to segment the game into it's different aspects (they managed to do this for the 2019 content poll... something along the lines of PvP, Skilling, Bossing, Raiding, questing, minigames etc).
After these game aspects have been segmented JaGex could utilize their current (mostly unused) facilities like the official forums and player moderation.
Each game aspect could have its own dedicated board on the forums where future updates are discussed and evaluated. There could be ingame/forum representatives (essentially pmods) assigned to each game aspect who would be in charge of facilitating constructive discussion, feedback and criticism in these boards.
There would be a minimum requirement to participate in the discussion of each game aspect ie. Skilling might require 2000+ total, Raiding might require 100kc CoX and 100kc ToB... maybe these are too high but you get the point (the aspect facilitator mods may have to have higher reqs and/or be known and trusted in their respective communities. Maybe they're voted in?).
PvP requirements would be a little more difficult to measure but we have BH kill trackers... It could be as simple (or difficult idk) as adding a PvP world kill tracker and wilderness kill tracker.
It would be within these forums that ideas are proposed, debated and then voted on to be implemented into the game. Obviously a player could participant in the discussion and voting on update ideas across different game aspects so long as they meet the requirements to join the forum/board.
The biggest challenge: This is not a perfect solution as none of these game aspects operate within a bubble. For example, a lot of skilling/bossing takes place in the wilderness... and bossing/raiding affects PvP in that it usually provides the equipment players use to PK. So there would be overlap. Boards/forums may potentially have to collaborate in the discussion/voting process? and I'm not sure how this would work (or if it would work at all)
Maybe this is where JaGex needs to step up as the product owner/game designers to make the executive decision.
A second challenge in implementing a system like this would be transparency. One of the plus sides to the current polling system is the addition of poll booths in game. Any player can (without going too much out of their way) click on a poll booth in a bank and have their 'say'. Relocating this decision making process to a forum would definitely reduce the amount of player participation in the development of the game. TBH I don't really see this as a negative—if someone can't be bothered taking a few minutes out of their day to browse what's being proposed to happen in the aspects of the game they are interested in, are they really going to have anything constructive to say in the first place?
Maybe the polling booths could be replaced by something that provides an in game view of the discussions that are taking place in the forums, thus prompting the user viewing them to go and get involved on the forums.
I feel like this would eliminate the two main issues ('lack of education/involvement' and 'mob rule/oppression') our current polling system creates—PvMers/PvPers wouldn't be able to maliciously sabotage an update which barely affects them if they aren't actively involved in those communities.
It would potentially allow a less biased discussion and voting system which may then allow some of the other great ideas being proposed on this board (That would never pass if they were voted on in our current system)
Any and all feedback welcome.
(Been thinking about this a bit lately and I've rushed this post on my lunch break so it may not be particularly coherent or complete)
TLDR: Problem:
Voting is flawed because of malicious and or thoughtless voting
Proposed solution (Constructive feedback/criticism welcomed):
Segment the games development into the different categories discussed in the 2019 content poll.
Provide forums with minimum requirements to participate within which ideas relating to that game aspect are discussed/validated/voted on.
Each forum would have a team of player facilitators/moderators who are trusted/experienced members of the community they represent
For a more in depth explanation, including some challenges this idea would have to overcome to be viable read the full topic
Welcome to the brew s9 lad, glad you’re enjoying your time in Misfits so far, you’ll find some toxic people on here but good to keep updated with how much we own other clans.
What is your IRL name or nickname?
Liam
What are your web/gaming interests?
OSRS, Crypto trading
Do you have any IRL hobbies?
Not really
RUNESCAPE/CLANNING
Are you a clanner? If so, which clan? If not, are you interested in clanning?
Misfits - yes
Do you have a RuneScape account? If so, show us.
maxed, 60 att 52 prayer. Maxed gear, kodai, tbow(obv for infernal).
What are your goals with your account or clanning career?
Get involved in the community a bit more as I've never done clanning ever. So everything is new.
Member of Misfits having a great time learning a lot on new shit and differences about clanning compared to the normal game.
Have had some fun already doing preps wildy trips and F2P.
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